Epic Games expert says iOS could be like macOS without security drawbacks

An Epic Games expert witness laid the groundwork for an argument that Apple could make iOS more like macOS in terms of app distribution and third-party access without suffering in security.

During his testimony on Friday, Harvard University Computer Science Professor James Mickens laid out the differences between iOS and macOS to Judge Yvonne Gonzalez Rogers. Some of the key areas of distinction include security, app distribution, and third-party app access.

For example, Mickens says that Apple's App Review process provides negligible security benefits over iOS's built-in defenses. That's because of mechanisms like sandboxing, which prevents app from interacting with other parts of the system.

At another point, when asked by Judge Gonzalez Rogers whether iOS is more secure than macOS, Mickens said that he believed it's not "meaningfully more secure."

Additionally, Mickens said that opening iOS to third-party app stores would not have a "meaningful difference on the security experience." If Apple opened up iOS, it wouldn't prevent users from only obtaining apps from the App Store, he added.

In response to the third-party access comment, Judge Gonzalez Rogers said that Mickens had "made a good point," but noted that she's concerned about the numbers.

At other points during his testimony, Mickens said it would be trivial to port security features like malware scanning and notarization to iOS.

Mickens' testimony defends a crux of Epic Games' argument against the iOS App Store. Epic notes Apple says both iOS and macOS are safe and secure, though Apple does not enforce the same restrictions on Mac. This seeming disconnect could undermine Apple's claims that security and privacy are at the heart of iOS App Store rules.

The Harvard University professor is slated to give additional testimony on Monday.

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77 Comments

Xed 2868 comments · 4 Years

About 3 years ago

Making iOS like macOS has been and will always will be the worst idea.

rob53 3307 comments · 13 Years

Idiot doesn’t know the differences. iOS always uses admin account while macOS has multiple user accounts with different privileges.

hackintoisier 86 comments · 5 Years

He’s right. macOS is much more open in terms of how users can install apps, and yet the Mac isn’t crawling with malware, unlike windows. Also, if iOS is opened to allow third party app stores, nothing would require users to download apps from those other stores if they didn’t want to. I’ve had an iPhone since 2007, but I recently started toying with android, and I’ve never used any other App Store besides the google play store even though others exist.

I think Apple is exerting too much control. For example, why is it that Netflix or any other app can’t tell me where and how to sign up for a subscription (if those apps don’t use IAP)?

When the iPhone ecosystem was small, Apple’s level of control wasn’t really on anyone’s radar, but as the iOS ecosystem has ballooned to billions of users and billions of dollars of trade, I can see why governments and courts around the planet are interested in how the ecosystem operates.

Others might disagree, but my view is Apple is in some ways restricting trade by disallowing the existence of other app stores. And the restriction of trade is why I believe it’s just a matter a time before the hammer drops, whether in the USA, or Europe or elsewhere.

hackintoisier said:

When the iPhone ecosystem was small, Apple’s level of control wasn’t really on anyone’s radar, but as the iOS ecosystem has ballooned to billions of users and billions of dollars of trade, I can see why governments and courts around the planet are interested in how the ecosystem operates.

So you're asking why a store wouldn't want to allow a product to lead them to another store where products are potentially more profitable for the seller? Have you ever seen TV at BestBuy advertise about buying the same TV at Walmart to save a couple bucks? Not only have I never seen that it's a ridiculous idea to think that Sony could advertise cheaper prices at Walmart from within a Best Buy.

Do you know what I do when I want to save money on a purchase? I look for discounts instead of just expecting them to manifest, but maybe that's me and my lack of entitlement speaking.

Xed said:

hackintoisier said:

When the iPhone ecosystem was small, Apple’s level of control wasn’t really on anyone’s radar, but as the iOS ecosystem has ballooned to billions of users and billions of dollars of trade, I can see why governments and courts around the planet are interested in how the ecosystem operates.

So you're asking why a store wouldn't want to allow a product to lead them to another store where products are potentially more profitable for the seller? Have you ever seen TV at BestBuy advertise about buying the same TV at Walmart to save a couple bucks?

I think you’re looking at this wrong. You say Best Buy should not allow the tv to advertise about Walmart while the tv is in the store. Fair point.

But you’re not talking about what the purchaser of the TV does with it AFTER they purchased it. Would you want Best Buy to have the power to tell Samsung or Sony (device manufacturer) that they’re restricted from allowing users to look at Walmart ads after they took the tv home? That would be ludicrous.

But yet Apple has the power to tell Netflix (app manufacturer) what users can do with the App AFTER we purchase/download the app? Once the app is on our phones, that’s akin to taking the tv home in my example above. That’s where your analogy breaks down in my view. Netflix should have the right to tell its users about subscription details, etc.